Viz's Debate: Week 1, Xbox--Good or Bad

[Vizior]

This is the first week I am going to try this, so let me do some explaining. I will start a debate every week or 2, and you will have the opportunity to participate and share your views in a mature manner. Now, I'll try and con Rexxie and Bort into giving those with the most persuasive arguments some contribution points. Now, these debates aren't going to be retarded topics like "Is Recycling the wax out of your ears important" ect, but stuff that might interest you.


The topic for this one: Is Xbox a wise choice for a gaming system.


How this works: now that you have a topic, you have one full week to persuade me to buy an Xbox. How you do this is by sharing personal experiences, web sites, features, games, showing another choice, ect.

There are only a few rules to this:

1. Be MATURE
2. Stay on-topic
3. Don't post replys like "^I agree with him"
4. Pick a side and stick with it, don't show both sides
5. Have fun, don't make it a chore


If this goes bad I won't hesitate to cut it off

[aarono]

Well seeing I"m a PC Enthusiast, I will have to join the side of non-Xbox Partisan. I beileve the Xbox, is just another way for Microsoft to make a few more dollars (I know they don't make any money but lose some on the console, but they make a ton off the games/equipment such as the Wonderful remote you needed just to watch Dvds $30). Another turn off to this console is the fanboyisms that are spawned from the X-Box Titles. For instance Halo, I beileve this must be one of the most overhyped games to ever touch the market, if someone here can present some very intriguing opinions as to why this game is so glorious.. please do so. Finally I think Microsoft didn't spend enough time on the system, the controller design does not fit many hands (my hand works fine but harder for say 9 and 10 year olds). In the end I say its a horrible console, and you should of used that money to supe up your forte.

[melee]

Ok, heres me story.

I got a PC, its the greatest gaming system of all times. Consoles dont really come close, but do server a purpose. As for consoles, I have always been a nintendo fan. Well in July, I started reading up about this new font hack. I ended up getting an xbox, not because I want to solely play xbox games, but because I wanted a "second PC" that hooked up to my TV easy. Stream music and videos, emulation (even N64 and PS!), linux, Er "backed up" games, and homebrew. Basically everything I did with my dreamcast with a better CPU, DVD-rom, and Ethernet (Got a 802.11b config now). All sorts of shit for $180. Heres what I did BTW:
http://www.bfnation.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=12926&

If you want to do this for xbox games, well, I can see that. Nice things for a console are multiplayer splitscreen and no setup. I like loading up Vice City without having to worry about setting up controls and graphics!
Lots of gaming exclusives, like the new Halo 2, and older ones (im playing through mechassault, great game). Enjoyed KOTOR long before all of you on PC!

Thats me though.

EDIT, aarono, your seeing this from a limited view. Its a rather cheap gaming console, you cant get a new (good!) video card for $180. Theres lots of games that are quite enjoyable for someone who doesnt want to hack, and so much shit if you do. Also Halo of Xbox>PC, so dont think the PC version is representive of the halo...
BTW I watch DVDs, and I never bought a remote

[aarono]

Herm.. I remeber my friend bitching about how he had to buy a $30 dollar remote to play Dvd's maybe hes just stupid. I know about the Xbox Hacks, etc. a few of them (on techtv) made me want to just try it out on a friends Xbox, screw it up, run home, and lock the door. But as with Halo, I've played with both versions and I own the pc one. I must say both are huge suckfests, biggest waste of $50 in my opinion (multiplayer is such a god damn bore) but I disliked the Xbox Version even more.

[melee]

Originally Posted by aarono

Herm.. I remeber my friend bitching about how he had to buy a $30 dollar remote to play Dvd's maybe hes just stupid. I know about the Xbox Hacks, etc. a few of them (on techtv) made me want to just try it out on a friends Xbox, screw it up, run home, and lock the door. But as with Halo, I've played with both versions and I own the pc one. I must say both are huge suckfests, biggest waste of $50 in my opinion (multiplayer is such a god damn bore) but I disliked the Xbox Version even more.

Well, for a non moddified xbox you need the kit to play DVDs, with Melee's leet mods, I just load up a homebrew DVD app.

The techtv thing was a little too quick IMO, there like "just splice the controller and a usb connection, then wire then as so [diagram flashes for .02 seconds] then load up linux! Look, its almost like we didnt spend 3 hours setting this up! :P

www.xbox-scene.com -ownage

[Mandingo]

Well, PC > All. That is a given.


Probably the biggest problem that I have with console gaming is the painfully shitty multiplayer.

I want to kill myself looking at that slpit screen. The only advantage that I can really see to buying an X-box over any other console is that you are going to have a huge social factor that comes into play with X-box Live. You can go online and hang out with some of your buddies ayn time of day or night. Vs any other console where they do have the internet based multiplayer but it is no where near as good. The fact that Microsoft runs all of it and sets certain standards for things is giant (no lag).


Yeah yeah yeah, "Only advantage? Look at the numbers Mandingo! This thing has the most power!" I don't care. If I look at a Ps2 then I look at an X-box. The graphics are not dramatically different enough for me to really give a shit. I say that the fact that this thing has got some awsome multiplayer action makes it the best.

[Bort]

XBOX is good for friends, PC is good for everyone.

[melee]

Originally Posted by Mandingo

Well, PC > All. That is a given.


Probably the biggest problem that I have with console gaming is the painfully shitty multiplayer.

I want to kill myself looking at that slpit screen. The only advantage that I can really see to buying an X-box over any other console is that you are going to have a huge social factor that comes into play with X-box Live. You can go online and hang out with some of your buddies ayn time of day or night. Vs any other console where they do have the internet based multiplayer but it is no where near as good. The fact that Microsoft runs all of it and sets certain standards for things is giant (no lag).


Yeah yeah yeah, "Only advantage? Look at the numbers Mandingo! This thing has the most power!" I don't care. If I look at a Ps2 then I look at an X-box. The graphics are not dramatically different enough for me to really give a shit. I say that the fact that this thing has got some awsome multiplayer action makes it the best.

Well as one of the few pro-xbox people, I guess Ill have to stick up for it.


Personally, I have never used Xbox live. (have used XBconnect) One problem being the new dash will takeout my mod so I cant. Even if it werent so, I still prolly wouldnt. PC is just great for Online, I hop on TS, and theres all the people I want to play online with. But with live you got the same thing with headset and buddy names...

One big thing is that all the games are custimized for the box. I have never had to upgrade it which is nice, and means I can play new games with my friends who dont upgrade their PC's. Multiplay is great, had a couple of friends over for xbox lan once, good stuff.

[carramrod01]

PC for me hands down.

From a technical standpoint any remotely modern PC will own an xbox. Get yourself a video card with TV-out, and you can get great FPS just like an x-box, better actually. The trick to having good graphics with x-box games is they are made to run at 640x480 on a TV screen. So when you think your PC is having trouble playing a game at 1280x1024 think if you had a card with tv-out, then you could run at 640x480 and be playing with 200fps on a 30" tv screen. That beats xbox if you ask me.

As far as games, I prefer a keyboard and mouse over a controller. A lot easier for shooters.

Not to mention you can download any game over p2p and play them. For xbox you would need a mod chip and even then you couldn't play it online. With PC you can play the games on cracked servers as well (but I did buy BF 1942 so I wasn't limited to cracked servers so don't look at me like that). Connect to xbox live with a modchip, try to play, and your banned. Ouch.

[Guru Imakuni]

X-Box is a good gaming system, but that's all relative. Out of GameCube, PS2, and X-Box; in almost every regard, X-Box loses. I won't mention PCs as a gaming platform because that just wouldn't be fair and the price tag difference is probably around 1300%.

X-Box does have a few hits, Halo for example. How Halo became a hit is anyone's guess. It also has the best graphics from a console at the moment -- most PS2 developers aren't utilizing the PS2's capabilites anywhere near the system's limits.

The X-Box game lineup isn't that extensive though. Halo, Project Gotham...that's all I can think of for hits right now!

At the time of release it was a totally untested product. Microsoft jumped into the console waters (and probably only succeeded due to its Microsoft name and having near infinite funding). Nintendo and Sony both had previous systems that could show their quality. Even after release X-Box's release and showing that it could sell, a lot of developers are still signing with Sony and Nintendo.

X-Box Live costs money too! PS2 does it for free (although a little more limited). I'd rather have decent online console multiplayer then having to pay $100 a year for slightly better service.

In my opinion, the X-Box is a good system. As I stated before it's all relative though. If I had to spend my money on 1,000 spiral bound notebooks or an X-Box I'd rather buy the spiral bound notebooks (because they'd probably bring more money back at a public auction ). X-Box is definetely not your best bet in the current generation of systems.

[Vizior]

I'm gonna through in another few things to spark up some more ideas


I was w/ some friends the other day, and we had 2 tvs and 2 xboxs on halo.... fucking amazing... it made me orgasm. I've considered getting XBOX just for when my friends are over

[melee]

Originally Posted by carramrod01

PC for me hands down.

From a technical standpoint any remotely modern PC will own an xbox. Get yourself a video card with TV-out, and you can get great FPS just like an x-box, better actually. The trick to having good graphics with x-box games is they are made to run at 640x480 on a TV screen. So when you think your PC is having trouble playing a game at 1280x1024 think if you had a card with tv-out, then you could run at 640x480 and be playing with 200fps on a 30" tv screen. That beats xbox if you ask me.

As far as games, I prefer a keyboard and mouse over a controller. A lot easier for shooters.

Not to mention you can download any game over p2p and play them. For xbox you would need a mod chip and even then you couldn't play it online. With PC you can play the games on cracked servers as well (but I did buy BF 1942 so I wasn't limited to cracked servers so don't look at me like that). Connect to xbox live with a modchip, try to play, and your banned. Ouch.

Christ, I thought I could stop replying, but I got to when some false info is being spread.

There’s alot of dealing with saying OMFG MY PC IS LEIK 800000 tiemz beta!!!! Well I admit that PC can produce graphics alot better. But, the games are made to be played perfectly at 640x480. They have the same high quality graphics settings, and use AA so I mean the issues of jagged edges is not there, one of the reasons of wanting a higher res. As for as more quality via more pixels per inch, It really doesn’t show that much on the low definition TV display due to blur. I have run my PC at 1024x768 on a TV(BF42 when R2R came out) , its nice, but the difference isn’t too much. I’m not saying an xbox is >/= PC merely saying is comparable, and is good for a cheap easy alternative. Also you can play xbox online with a modchip/fonthack you just have to use a 3rd party app like XBconnect or other tunneling software Xlink, gamespy tunnel, Etc… (no cracked shit to worry about) or turn off the mod and use live. You have to deal with the same type of annoyance of using a crack in PC as you do with using a 3rd party app on the box.
I am totally with buying a game for online, online games deserved to be bought to be enjoyed.

Originally Posted by Vizior

I'm gonna through in another few things to spark up some more ideas


I was w/ some friends the other day, and we had 2 tvs and 2 xboxs on halo.... fucking amazing... it made me orgasm. I've considered getting XBOX just for when my friends are over

As I said, I have had this happen, fun times, had one on my PC monitor one on my 20" flat screen. Great stuff.

Originally Posted by Guru Imakuni

X-Box is a good gaming system, but that's all relative. Out of GameCube, PS2, and X-Box; in almost every regard, X-Box loses

Er, I have a cube (2, ones broke), don’t even want to touch the PS2 (hyped crap) I think xbox is really the best choice there. Depends on who you are, and what your friends use (just like operating systems…)

And that’s melees preach of the night, I can’t believe I’m the only one with this opinion

[carramrod01]

Originally Posted by melee

Christ, I thought I could stop replying, but I got to when some false info is being spread.

Umm melee you pretty much repeated what I said just adding certain words in to sound like xbox is better. I'm going to quote myself here but you will see what I mean.

Originally Posted by carramrod01

they are made to run at 640x480 on a TV screen

Originally Posted by melee

the games are made to be played perfectly at 640x480.

See just adding "perfectly" doesn't do a whole lot for your arguement. The bottom line remains you could hook up any somewhat modern computer to a TV, run it at 640x480 and have it perform just as good as an xbox. There was a time when xbox's graphics were considered to be the best, i guess, but the time is over. All I see xbox being better than PC's for is "ease of play." I guess thats a good way to put it.

[melee]

Originally Posted by carramrod01

Umm melee you pretty much repeated what I said just adding certain words in to sound like xbox is better. I'm going to quote myself here but you will see what I mean.

See just adding "perfectly" doesn't do a whole lot for your arguement. The bottom line remains you could hook up any somewhat modern computer to a TV, run it at 640x480 and have it perform just as good as an xbox. There was a time when xbox's graphics were considered to be the best, i guess, but the time is over. All I see xbox being better than PC's for is "ease of play." I guess thats a good way to put it.

Er, I never said that xbox was better, I thought I made that clear.

When I say it was made to play perfectly at 640x480, I should have said customized to be played at 640x480 with the set graphics, where a PC game is made to be played at all sorts of resolutions and settings. Optimazation in an xbox is key. If you set up halo 640x480 on a TV, I can assure you it would not look as good as the xbox version, even with DX9 features and a higher Framerate(which doesnt contribute to IQ, but whatever). The xbox version was made to be played oneway, the PC was made to be played many. Its like a 10 speed bike customized for the street vs a 21 speed made for everything. *Please do not take literally,but get the point. Xbox has no OS, its just running the game, no driver coruptions and crap.

I think I did more than repeated what you said, I replied to what you said and made my arguement, by saying that you show how little you read.

I seem to like these debate things. Next week I say we go for best leaked sex tape but thats just me.

[RichM]

Sorry, melee - I have to side with the anti-console crowd here. I admit, I've been biased toward PC's for a long time - the last console I had was an original Nintendo back in 1988...

However, A good friend of mine brought his X-box over the other night, and we plugged it in. I'll give the X-box the graphics edge; however, I found myself sitting on the edge of the coffee table to see better what was going on (We were playing NFS:U). I also purely and unobjectively hate game controllers like that; for my pc, I have the kb/mouse combo for shooters, a joystick for flying, and a wheel/pedal set for racing. I personally find that, out of the box and unmodded, a PC just has much greater versatility and range.

JM.02W...

[slytiger]

Let me say first off i am a pc guy and probably will always be a pc guy. But consoles still hold some ground with me. PC's currently are the best gaming system out but the problem is it is hard for alot of people to get to gether and just have a hell of a lot of fun. And if you have friends like mines they dont want to hassel with the wireing for each comp and internet play horrors. Consoles are for these people because all they really have to do is just hook up an ethernet cable to each of the boxs and plug the controllers in and its ready to go. Plus theres nothing like having 16 people in the same room on 2 teams with halo ctf.
Basically if you have friends or ur self dont like to hassel with the stresses of pc gaming setup than an xbox is great for you. I personally havent played the GC with more than one cube mostly because i dont even know anyone who has connectors for each cube and there arnt that many appealing games out for it. I also havent tried the ps2 with lan parties so im not sure how well it works. But i can gaurentee you will have some of the most fun ever with 16 of ur friends slaughtering eachother and seeing eachothers reactions, theres nothing like it so i do suggest that you get it.

[Guru Imakuni]

I agree with slytiger. Though, for real "gamers" PC is the way to go for sure.

Sony has stopped making PS2s with the iLink port. No more LAN. The only game that used it was Gran Turismo 3 as far as I know, but 4 should have online multiplayer.