BF2, competitive play, aiming and stuff.

[IamCypher]

Okay, I'm a competitive ET player who recently got BF2 since it seems interesting, now, I was wondering how much this game is actually played competitively.

As far as I can see, it has some serious drawbacks for that: The unlock system basically makes clan matches unbalanced with rewards to the clans who spent a ridiculous amount of time point whoring on publics, rather than the clans who are actually better at the game itself. Second, The huge team size needed to realistically play a game(8v8?), not many clans will survive that long because of this, which will make the competitive scene die quicker. LAN's are hard to organize for that team size, too. And finally, the totally screwed up aiming/accuracy system, which I have a special rant about below. Now, I didn't get to play BF1942 or vietnam(didn't have a good enough net connection back then), so I don't know how they were in that respect and would appreciate somebody to enlighten me on that, too.

Now about the AIMING system, it sucks. I wish I could be a bit less blunt about this but I find it hard to put it any other way. The game, from my experience does not require any aim. Apart from the "best gun wins" syndrome which is not that bad in BF2, The bullet spread is just way too huge. The fact that the game rewards making yourself stationary(prone) seems a bit weird to me. As it is now, it's all about going prone first and getting the lucky shots in, since the deviation is ridiculous when not prone, not to talk about moving, which only works at close quarters. Tracking a moving target is super easy since there is only one moving speed which is quite slow.

Also wtf is up with bunny hopping, tracking someone who is just jumping is easier than somebody who is running because you cannot change direction in jump so I can easily calculate your trajectory. Why do people use it, or worse, complain about it? Now, I'm not using it, mostly because I never actually seen it work against me, but this is a stupid tactic that recieves more attention than it deserves tbh.

I would like to hear more thoughts and comments about this so feel free to share.

[jackbauer06]

you just have to know how to fight with the system. its not bad, its just not the CS spray where you can follow your bullet trials for headshots. i personally have a style where i run at guys while shooting, it works sometimes, as long as i am my unlocked SF, which is te best spray and pray gun theere is in BF2. in respect to matches, i agree. you'd have to have 8 hardcore guys to play a decent match, 16 would be better, but i wanna hear about the first 16 v 16 clan match.

[mrhahn]

Originally Posted by IamCypher

As far as I can see, it has some serious drawbacks for that: The unlock system basically makes clan matches unbalanced with rewards to the clans who spent a ridiculous amount of time point whoring on publics, rather than the clans who are actually better at the game itself.

Most leagues have a no-unlocks rule. So even if your team has unlocked the weapons, you can't use them in official matches to keep it all balanced.

Second, The huge team size needed to realistically play a game(8v8?), not many clans will survive that long because of this, which will make the competitive scene die quicker.

Really? I thought 8v8 was pretty small. The competitive scene's doing pretty well at the moment - you've got TeamWarfare League, Cyberathlete Amateur League, things like ClanBase too.

The fact that the game rewards making yourself stationary(prone) seems a bit weird to me. As it is now, it's all about going prone first and getting the lucky shots in, since the deviation is ridiculous when not prone, not to talk about moving, which only works at close quarters. Tracking a moving target is super easy since there is only one moving speed which is quite slow.

I think it makes sense that you're more accurate when you're proned. But I do agree that it's annoying to run round a corner into an enemy and die just because he can prone faster than you. As for moving, there are two speeds really - normal and sprinting.

Also wtf is up with bunny hopping, tracking someone who is just jumping is easier than somebody who is running because you cannot change direction in jump so I can easily calculate your trajectory.

Bunny hopping in long-range combat isn't the problem really. It's more when you're in each other's faces, and the other guy's hopping like mad - gets pretty irritating.

[grim reaper]

BF2 in not being Quake shocker.

[GroundZero]

Originally Posted by jackbauer06

you just have to know how to fight with the system. its not bad, its just not the CS spray where you can follow your bullet trials for headshots. i personally have a style where i run at guys while shooting, it works sometimes, as long as i am my unlocked SF, which is te best spray and pray gun theere is in BF2. in respect to matches, i agree. you'd have to have 8 hardcore guys to play a decent match, 16 would be better, but i wanna hear about the first 16 v 16 clan match.

Battlefield: 2: Match Training =]GAF[= vs. AWOL Training, 06.10.2005 Thu
Server IP: 85.236.100.173:16567
Player per Team: 14

Will be 16v16 if they can get another couple of players
Already had a few similar, but normally its 8v8 or 10v10

The huge team size needed to realistically play a game(8v8?), not many clans will survive that long because of this, which will make the competitive scene die quicker

Like mrhahn said, I agree that 8 v 8 is pretty small, any less and you may as well not be a clan, never played ET, but if you think 8 players is big after coming from it, doesn't look like I'd want to

Many clans have been around since the original BF, if not even earlier, and most ladder based matches have always been this size.

[Muxje]

The fact that the game rewards making yourself stationary(prone) seems a bit weird to me. As it is now, it's all about going prone first and getting the lucky shots in, since the deviation is ridiculous when not prone, not to talk about moving, which only works at close quarters.

Well, it's like that in real life. Stabilising yourself helps your accuracy a great deal. However, I agree that it's a bit strange to have someone drop to the ground and immediately squeeze off a super-accurate shot. If you do that in real life, you'll need a few seconds to position yourself on the ground, bring the gun to bear, and settle your breath. They should really use a few seconds delay after going prone, before the extra accuracy kicks in.

As for bunny hopping, I wish they'd make aiming even more inaccurate when jumping, and make it so that people can't jump with 0 stamina, and can't jump more than 2/3 times in a row before their stamina is depleted. Killing a bunny takes a bit of practice, but once you're used to it, it's no harder than killing a regular target. I tend to fire in bursts anyway, and I just time my bursts for the top of their jump, when they are usually completely stationary. It annoys me though, because it looks so stupid.

[Dick_Justice]

We had enough members in our clan/community back with Forgotten Hope, that we could play with up to 25 players per team...

[MM | Hollywood]

If you want to play in a 64-player competitive format - check out the 21cw tourney at http://www.21stcenturywarfare.com/

[Rambo_Medic]

I find it hilarious that two people just randomly jumped in and blabbed about leagues and stuff..

Also, I find it annoying that so many people just come in these forums to b*** and whine about everything they think is wrong with the game. (read: that kills them)


Anywho, I'm gonna shutup cause these guys basically answered everything.

[Jan Zizka]

I never played any of the BF previous iterations but used to play a lot of FPS games like Quake, DOOM, Half Life, etc. Last night however, my view of these type games changed forever.

I was playing the 'Karkland' map and was on the MEC side I believe it was. My team ended up with our backs to the walls with one final spawn point available, the one across the bridge. The US side was pressing hard to cross the bridge and overrun our position and I was playing the sniper class. It was the singularly most exilirating/hair raising/enjoyable experience I have had in the many years I have been playing games. Artillery was falling, the opposing team was rushing to cross the bridge, I had a good snipers position and was doing my best to stem their advance and what I realized was just how much more intense it is when faced with human opponents. The combat is usually spread out over the map but it become focused in this case over one bridge.....It literally felt like a scene from 'Saving Private Ryan' or 'Band of Brothers'.....it was what games should be and I am hooked.

I personally love this game and have lost my interest in games like Quake 4 which just came out, they no longer hold the same appeal (turn corner, face monster, repeat...) and I personally think that BF2 will only get better with a few more patches and the expansion pack.

[Cøyøte]

Originally Posted by Jan Zizka

It was the singularly most exilirating/hair raising/enjoyable experience I have had in the many years I have been playing games.

That reminds me of the first time I played Ghost Recon.... half the gamers Ive talked to since never knew it outside of the Playstation.
Consoles. What a way to kill a good tactical FPS. *Sigh*

[Jan Zizka]

Coyote,

I failed to mention GR, that was a great game in my opinion ( I never play anything but PC by the way) and only since I built my new computer have I stopped playing GR.

The sound quality, range of vehicles, weapons and communication options (VOIP) coupled with playing human opponents make BF2 an experience unlike anything else, at least for me. I think it is a great game and I am so grateful to Dice and EA for their work.

Good job guys.

[NDA]

Originally Posted by Rambo_Medic

I find it hilarious that two people just randomly jumped in and blabbed about leagues and stuff.

Not really random, since the topic was specifically about competitive play (please refer to thread topic: BF2, competitive play, aiming and stuff).

The aiming mechanics will be the downfall of competitive play for Battlefield 2. Opinion? Sure ... but in game you've got zero control of where your spray goes. And, yes, spray is the appropriate word; single shot fire is relatively accurate and quite deadly. In the modern battlefield single shot fire is not a common tactic, unless you are in a scout-sniper type of position. Suppression (aka accurate spraying) is your friend in real life, but in BF2 suppression is a joke ... the rounds do not go where you are aiming, nor do people fear the suppression of the incredibly inaccurate weapons in BF2.

[Dick_Justice]

The Battlefield series has been around for long enough now to have established a compeditive league.

It might not be quite as sophisticated compared to CS etc but its still quite popular.

Its just a bit different, thats something to get used to...

[Beyond_Valor]

Originally Posted by IamCypher

Now about the AIMING system, it sucks. I wish I could be a bit less blunt about this but I find it hard to put it any other way. The game, from my experience does not require any aim. Apart from the "best gun wins" syndrome which is not that bad in BF2, The bullet spread is just way too huge. The fact that the game rewards making yourself stationary(prone) seems a bit weird to me. As it is now, it's all about going prone first and getting the lucky shots in, since the deviation is ridiculous when not prone, not to talk about moving, which only works at close quarters. Tracking a moving target is super easy since there is only one moving speed which is quite slow.

I agree, after playing awhile and comparing it to BF42. Theres something a little fucked about it. I've learned the 1st one who drops to the floor (with most weapons) first wins it the fight.

I dunno how many times I practically empty a clip into someones upper torso area first while standing , he drops to ground pops off a couple of rounds and I'm dead.

Don't get me going on the engineers shotgun.

[Caslon]

Head shots do more damage than chest and leg shots. If you drop to the ground, chances are you get better aim at the head.

[Xee Thot]

I for one know that headshots mean nothing. I have emptied half a clip of a G36C into the face of an enemy at a so close range that I could see his face turning to the side with every shot and he still killed me with a couple of bursts to the chest/torso.

[Caslon]

It's a wild world of net connections, net prediction, dropped packets.

On an ideal lan network, it should be as I described, and as the games netcode was programmed, for all.

[Cøyøte]

Packet loss, as with the rest, works both ways....

AND, with no further ado...

IF a packet hits a pocket on a socket on a port,

And the bus is interrupted as a very last resort, And the address of the memory makes your floppy disk abort, Then the socket packet pocket has an error to report!

IF your cursor finds a menu item followed by a dash, And the double-clicking icon puts your window in the trash, And your data is corrupted 'cause the index doesn't hash, Then your situation's hopeless, and your system's gonna crash!

You can't say this? What a shame sir! We'll find you, Another game sir.

IF the label on the cable on the table at your house, Says the network is connected to the button on your mouse, But your packets want to tunnel on another protocol, That's repeatedly rejected by the printer down the hall!

IF your screen is all distorted by the side effects of gauss, So your icons in the window are as wavey as a souse, Then you may as well reboot and go out with a bang, 'Cause as sure as I'm a poet, the sucker's gonna hang!

IF the copy of your floppy's getting sloppy on the disk, And the microcode instructions cause unnecessary RISC, Then you have to flash your memory, and you'll want to RAM your ROM. Quickly turn off the computer and be sure to tell your MOM!

*The previous being blatently stolen from, whatever source I stole it from, as I couldnt recall it in its entirety.