Snipers, are they BF2's most underrated class?

Morat · 09-25-2005, 10:33 PM

A shocking topic I know, and I for one had so far considered engineer to be the most underrated class. Surely it had to be, does anyone even see an engineer much? Every now and then there are a few mines around, but there's not a whole lot of engy love going around.

Then it happened, I decided to try that red-headed step-child class. In all the time I've had the game I only played sniper once, for two minutes, while trying to kill an enemy sniper. I died. Couldn't. Hit. Jack. Shit.

So I decided to give it a proper go. For half an hour, BF2's bots fell prey to my cross-hairs of doom. Well knife vs. SVD is hardly a fair fight now is it. I felt brave enough to go online, and you know what? It was pretty good. Just so long as I remembered one thing. Snipers are not long-range death dealers, operating across some wasteland desert map with no cover.

In the few sessions where I've played sniper full time it seems reasonably clear that DICE have done their rock, scissors, paper magic on the sniper class. They're not intended to sit off on the map edge, peering greedily over a polygon-free 1998-era vista shooting at pixels. There's too much cover, too few open vistas (on most maps) for that. I can't help but think that the essence of sniping in BF2 is...

Snipers trade close-quarters combat ability for a medium range, high accuracy support role.

Sure, you can play sniper in the traditional lone-wolf way, but the maps are generally too cluttered and fluid for that. Too often you'd find yourself too far from the battle with no line of sight. I'm convinced that sniping in BF2 is quite possibly an essential role in an effective squad. Who else can hang back and maintain a wide field of view with an effective level of accuracy? If this isn't the sniper's intended role, why do MEC and Chinese forces deploy with semi-auto rifles that can barely be considered sniper weapons in the traditional sense?

Flame me if you will, but I'm sure there's more to this class when played well than most people think. Just get down off your towers, stay off the hills and get in with your squad for the good of the team.

(Oh and don't mention all those enemy tickets you'll reduce with every kill...)

BenSpazz · 09-25-2005, 10:59 PM

sniping in essential. wen with a sqaud i hang with them, wen we go to cap a flag ill stay behind a few hundred yards an cover them agaisnt infantry, and warn them of incoming armour (as the sniper rifle is a great spotting tool)

also, its an awesome defense class. lay a claymore at a flag, go snuggle up sumwhere with a clear line of sight to the flag, and have at it.

Muxje · 09-25-2005, 11:47 PM

Not shocking at all...

Playing sniper like you 2 describe, as part of a team, can be a lot of fun. Having a sniper like that in a squad is nice too... when you're at the flag with a sniper covering you, you're rarely surprised.

It *is* still possible to go it alone on some of the maps. More so than in BF42, it's important to pick a good position, and to keep moving as well. Stay put, and you'll likely end up with a knife in your back.

Mephisto · 09-25-2005, 11:57 PM

good job, now youve gone and made me wanna play as sniper. be back in an hour

K_Shizzle · 09-26-2005, 12:37 AM

i like to go with my squad down the right side at Karkard. I snipe inbetween the buildings to cover them

Trident · 09-26-2005, 01:10 AM

I don't use sniper class at all... never really like it much even in 1942. I like to be on the assault where most of the action is.

BUT... snipers are like jet pilots. You have to be really good at it to be really affective. I can say personally that there are VERY good snipers out there. I sniper on an urban style map can be dangerous. I can remember playing on a map where my squad actually stopped assaulting flags to look for a sniper that was causing problems

420 · 09-26-2005, 01:41 AM

All I know is that all of my knife kills were on snipers

insinuwait · 09-26-2005, 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 420

All I know is that all of my knife kills were on snipers

Indeed, more with the Shock Paddles for me when I play medic, just because its a slap in the face to the other guy

jackbauer06 · 09-26-2005, 02:41 AM

if you snipe, its better to have the upgraded. it shoots through vehicles and probably kills in 1 shot. i know all can agree, that it sucks when it takes 2 or 3 shots to kill someone.

Random Ping · 09-26-2005, 03:34 AM

The only time I have ever been afraid of a sniper is at an airfield, because like jack said, the upgraded sniper can shoot through vehicles. But most of the time, snipers are only good enough to annoy me into sneaking up and knifing them. I tried being a sniper for a while, alone, but like the rest of you have witnessed first hand, you don't last very long. Morat is right, sniping within a squad is the best for most snipers, their cover has saved my butt many times when I was attacking large groups of enemies.

One of my favorite moments was in Sharqi, when I was being chase by to knife-weilding foes, unbenownst to me. I heard sniper fire behind me and turn around to see the closest guys dead body fall right into me. The next guy is 5 feet behind him and was taken down just as fast by my friendly sniper. Like me, those guys had no clue what was coming.

Stephen M · 09-27-2005, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morat

Who else can hang back and maintain a wide field of view with an effective level of accuracy? If this isn't the sniper's intended role, why do MEC and Chinese forces deploy with semi-auto rifles that can barely be considered sniper weapons in the traditional sense?

I think you've hit the nail on the head. My understanding was that the semi-auto sniper rifles such as the SVD were developed, in real life, for the tactics you described above: a medium ranged, precision fire, squad support role...NOT a long range lone wolf assasination tool. The few times I played sniper I was certainly more effective working as fire support for a squad, rather than operating alone at long ranges.

Gort · 09-27-2005, 04:51 PM

Altho I like playing the role of scout/sniper, I find they are actually pretty useless and I know that in league play that our preference is not to use the sniper class.

They are useless at close range unless they are lucky or switch to a pistol.

The cross hairs are extremely thick and therefore at distance, it's way to easy to miss (I don't know if anyone else has this problem, but my vertical cross hair changes thickness slightly as I taverse my sights). Medium range is most effective but long range is next to impossible to be consistant. I always thought distance was supposed to be a snipers friend...

Head shots kills (1 shot) are rare even with the M95.

I'm really hoping the tweeks that are coming to the sniper class will make the kit a little more effective (and enjoyable) to play. They really need to make the M95 more powerful. 1 shot from the M95 above the waist should be a critical wound. Any shot to the head from any of the sniper rifles should be a kill (no reviving by a medic, you can't tell me that cardiac paddles can fix someones brains falling out of a crater of an exit hole)

Trident · 09-27-2005, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gort

I'm really hoping the tweeks that are coming to the sniper class will make the kit a little more effective (and enjoyable) to play.

I'm with ya on that one. DC mod for 1942 did just that I think. I think even in 1942 it was easier to snipe with the engeneer class than the sniper. But the mods with fix a lot of things in the sniper class I think.

Jan Zizka · 10-19-2005, 08:08 PM

Played Shongua last night as a sniper and I felt like I was able to make a good contribution to the team effort.

Example, one of my teammates was attcking the China base with a Cobra helo, their guys kept jumping in the SAM launcher and damaging his helo. I had a really good spot to see what was going on so I started targeting anyone that got near the launcher and guess what....they strated to steer clear of it, enabling our Cobra to strafe and rocket the base at will. Also, I would spot and broadcast enemy sightings helping maintain visibility on what the enemy was doing.

In short, I believe snipers can be pretty effective in supporting on going operations, as a scout and to deny the enemy access to key equipment/areas.

chickenz · 10-20-2005, 01:13 AM

Sniper sux, period.

The only time it's useful is you can use M95 shoot teammate out of the jet and then jack it.

Caslon · 10-20-2005, 03:22 AM

Can snipers even take out someone with one shot? I usually only get down
to red health being shot by sniper with one bullet. In BF1942, one head shot would kill.

I've gotten killed with some claymores put on stairs where the area was so dark, I couldn't even see them.

BF2 could just remove the sniper class and it wouldn't impact any team winning...it would sure piss off ppl that like to lie around tho.

Monkeyfeng · 10-20-2005, 05:27 AM

but you have to agree, claymores are fun!

Caslon · 10-20-2005, 07:02 AM

I'm for snipers, how else to get a basic knife badge?

Trident · 10-20-2005, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caslon

I'm for snipers, how else to get a basic knife badge?

So true

Jan Zizka · 10-28-2005, 05:28 PM

Snipers can kill in one shot, it just needs to be a nice cean head shot...then that big melon goes POP!

They're great as scouts as well, get close to an enemy base and report their movements. The keys to being a sniper is good positioning, concelament, patience and a responsive commander to drop ammo for you.

09-25-2005, 10:33 PM	#1 (permalink)
Morat Master Warrant Officer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Diving towards your pos with my finger on the bomb release... Posts: 1,188	Snipers, are they BF2's most underrated class? A shocking topic I know, and I for one had so far considered engineer to be the most underrated class. Surely it had to be, does anyone even see an engineer much? Every now and then there are a few mines around, but there's not a whole lot of engy love going around. Then it happened, I decided to try that red-headed step-child class. In all the time I've had the game I only played sniper once, for two minutes, while trying to kill an enemy sniper. I died. Couldn't. Hit. Jack. Shit. So I decided to give it a proper go. For half an hour, BF2's bots fell prey to my cross-hairs of doom. Well knife vs. SVD is hardly a fair fight now is it. I felt brave enough to go online, and you know what? It was pretty good. Just so long as I remembered one thing. Snipers are not long-range death dealers, operating across some wasteland desert map with no cover. In the few sessions where I've played sniper full time it seems reasonably clear that DICE have done their rock, scissors, paper magic on the sniper class. They're not intended to sit off on the map edge, peering greedily over a polygon-free 1998-era vista shooting at pixels. There's too much cover, too few open vistas (on most maps) for that. I can't help but think that the essence of sniping in BF2 is... Snipers trade close-quarters combat ability for a medium range, high accuracy support role. Sure, you can play sniper in the traditional lone-wolf way, but the maps are generally too cluttered and fluid for that. Too often you'd find yourself too far from the battle with no line of sight. I'm convinced that sniping in BF2 is quite possibly an essential role in an effective squad. Who else can hang back and maintain a wide field of view with an effective level of accuracy? If this isn't the sniper's intended role, why do MEC and Chinese forces deploy with semi-auto rifles that can barely be considered sniper weapons in the traditional sense? Flame me if you will, but I'm sure there's more to this class when played well than most people think. Just get down off your towers, stay off the hills and get in with your squad for the good of the team. (Oh and don't mention all those enemy tickets you'll reduce with every kill...) __________________ Desktop wallpapers by Morat at caedes

09-25-2005, 10:59 PM	#2 (permalink)
BenSpazz Command Sergeant Major Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: LaGrange, Ohio Posts: 716	sniping in essential. wen with a sqaud i hang with them, wen we go to cap a flag ill stay behind a few hundred yards an cover them agaisnt infantry, and warn them of incoming armour (as the sniper rifle is a great spotting tool) also, its an awesome defense class. lay a claymore at a flag, go snuggle up sumwhere with a clear line of sight to the flag, and have at it. __________________ My Stats

09-25-2005, 11:57 PM	#4 (permalink)
Mephisto Captain Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,670	good job, now youve gone and made me wanna play as sniper. be back in an hour __________________ Mephisto is among the most powerful of the universe's known demonic forces - www.googlism.com

09-26-2005, 12:37 AM	#5 (permalink)
K_Shizzle Master Warrant Officer Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: New York, USA Posts: 1,257	i like to go with my squad down the right side at Karkard. I snipe inbetween the buildings to cover them __________________ "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." -Ben Franklin

09-26-2005, 02:41 AM	#9 (permalink)
jackbauer06 Private 1st Class Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Tempe, Az Posts: 120	if you snipe, its better to have the upgraded. it shoots through vehicles and probably kills in 1 shot. i know all can agree, that it sucks when it takes 2 or 3 shots to kill someone. __________________

09-25-2005, 11:47 PM	#3 (permalink)
Muxje Private Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 60	Not shocking at all... Playing sniper like you 2 describe, as part of a team, can be a lot of fun. Having a sniper like that in a squad is nice too... when you're at the flag with a sniper covering you, you're rarely surprised. It is still possible to go it alone on some of the maps. More so than in BF42, it's important to pick a good position, and to keep moving as well. Stay put, and you'll likely end up with a knife in your back.

09-26-2005, 01:10 AM	#6 (permalink)
Trident First Sergeant Join Date: May 2005 Location: Pennsylvania - USA Posts: 578	I don't use sniper class at all... never really like it much even in 1942. I like to be on the assault where most of the action is. BUT... snipers are like jet pilots. You have to be really good at it to be really affective. I can say personally that there are VERY good snipers out there. I sniper on an urban style map can be dangerous. I can remember playing on a map where my squad actually stopped assaulting flags to look for a sniper that was causing problems

09-26-2005, 01:41 AM	#7 (permalink)
420 General Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 2,605	All I know is that all of my knife kills were on snipers

09-26-2005, 03:34 AM	#10 (permalink)
Random Ping Master Warrant Officer Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Evergreen State (at least on the West coast) Posts: 1,293	The only time I have ever been afraid of a sniper is at an airfield, because like jack said, the upgraded sniper can shoot through vehicles. But most of the time, snipers are only good enough to annoy me into sneaking up and knifing them. I tried being a sniper for a while, alone, but like the rest of you have witnessed first hand, you don't last very long. Morat is right, sniping within a squad is the best for most snipers, their cover has saved my butt many times when I was attacking large groups of enemies. One of my favorite moments was in Sharqi, when I was being chase by to knife-weilding foes, unbenownst to me. I heard sniper fire behind me and turn around to see the closest guys dead body fall right into me. The next guy is 5 feet behind him and was taken down just as fast by my friendly sniper. Like me, those guys had no clue what was coming. __________________ It is not important that the glass is half-full or half-empty, but rather how the glass got that way.

09-27-2005, 04:51 PM	#12 (permalink)
Gort Warrant Officer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Southern BC, Canada Posts: 825	Altho I like playing the role of scout/sniper, I find they are actually pretty useless and I know that in league play that our preference is not to use the sniper class. They are useless at close range unless they are lucky or switch to a pistol. The cross hairs are extremely thick and therefore at distance, it's way to easy to miss (I don't know if anyone else has this problem, but my vertical cross hair changes thickness slightly as I taverse my sights). Medium range is most effective but long range is next to impossible to be consistant. I always thought distance was supposed to be a snipers friend... Head shots kills (1 shot) are rare even with the M95. I'm really hoping the tweeks that are coming to the sniper class will make the kit a little more effective (and enjoyable) to play. They really need to make the M95 more powerful. 1 shot from the M95 above the waist should be a critical wound. Any shot to the head from any of the sniper rifles should be a kill (no reviving by a medic, you can't tell me that cardiac paddles can fix someones brains falling out of a crater of an exit hole) __________________ 8)´

10-19-2005, 08:08 PM	#14 (permalink)
Jan Zizka Private Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 81	Snipers Played Shongua last night as a sniper and I felt like I was able to make a good contribution to the team effort. Example, one of my teammates was attcking the China base with a Cobra helo, their guys kept jumping in the SAM launcher and damaging his helo. I had a really good spot to see what was going on so I started targeting anyone that got near the launcher and guess what....they strated to steer clear of it, enabling our Cobra to strafe and rocket the base at will. Also, I would spot and broadcast enemy sightings helping maintain visibility on what the enemy was doing. In short, I believe snipers can be pretty effective in supporting on going operations, as a scout and to deny the enemy access to key equipment/areas.

10-20-2005, 01:13 AM	#15 (permalink)
chickenz Private Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 26	Sniper sux, period. The only time it's useful is you can use M95 shoot teammate out of the jet and then jack it. __________________

10-20-2005, 03:22 AM	#16 (permalink)
Caslon Lieutenant Colonel Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Deep inside the Earth. Posts: 4,782	Can snipers even take out someone with one shot? I usually only get down to red health being shot by sniper with one bullet. In BF1942, one head shot would kill. I've gotten killed with some claymores put on stairs where the area was so dark, I couldn't even see them. BF2 could just remove the sniper class and it wouldn't impact any team winning...it would sure piss off ppl that like to lie around tho.

10-20-2005, 05:27 AM	#17 (permalink)
Monkeyfeng Captain Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Taiwan, can you find it on the map? Posts: 2,785	but you have to agree, claymores are fun! __________________

10-20-2005, 07:02 AM	#18 (permalink)
Caslon Lieutenant Colonel Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Deep inside the Earth. Posts: 4,782	I'm for snipers, how else to get a basic knife badge?

10-28-2005, 05:28 PM	#20 (permalink)
Jan Zizka Private Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 81	One shot one kill Snipers can kill in one shot, it just needs to be a nice cean head shot...then that big melon goes POP! They're great as scouts as well, get close to an enemy base and report their movements. The keys to being a sniper is good positioning, concelament, patience and a responsive commander to drop ammo for you.